i spoke to frankie as well. >> is it well with the two of you? have you made peace? >> no. >> okay. >> because -- because they've been hurt too badly. and a 40-minute conversation isn't enough. and it -- >> yes. because you repeatedly characterize her as crazy, called her other horrible things and -- >> well, and i clarified something. i did call her crazy. >> you did. >> i did. i did. >> if you would go back and look at all the tapes and things you said over the years about betsy -- >> and i -- and i think she'd be okay with me saying this, but, i mean, i can take the liberty to say it and say, listen, i called you crazy, i called you a bitch, i called you all these things, but i never called you fat. >> that's one of the things she said -- >> she said i thought you were acting crazy but -- >> well, i guess i was all these years putting up with that. how would you act? sweet as apple pie? >> the idea that somehow not calling you fat is any kind of -- >> consolation? >> yeah. when i heard that, my jaw dropped. >> he shouldn't have done oprah. he should -- this was to